Hangin' with Mike Kanan pt 2

For those of you digging on some of Mike's little gems of advice you will have an opportunity to receive them yourself in person if you are in the New York area on Sunday, October 19th.

The Art of Accompanying and the Art of Being Accompanied
Master Class with Alexa Fila & Mike Kanan
Joe Solomon Studio
1133 Broadway, 6th fl (at 26th St) Room 621, NYC
phone: 212 741-2839
email: joesolomio@yahoo.com

Brief description: ...
"A Full set with these two wonderful artists will be followed by 30min Q&A. The final set will offer an opportunity for vocalists to sit in with Mike. If he or she wishes, each singer may solicit commentary and guidance from these two masters of the vocal jazz art form..."


JR: So you like these kind of chords (I start playing Abmaj7 chord phrases as inversions)

MK: Right, exactly. Well now uh... well anyway which direction do want to go with this. We could talk in about twenty different directions with this:) Where'd should we go?

JR: Naw, this is good for me. You've already given me two nuggets (of info) that I'm going to be using. It's going to be paragraph one, paragraph 2..

MK: (Laughs) ok! Good. Do you want to talk about accompanying for a minute?

JR: Like doing introductions and stuff? Could you rattle off some type of typical introduction that you like? Like a ballad for let's say. Any key.

MK: Alright. I doubt if I'm going to say anything you don't already know. But...It's just about being clear and leading in. Sometimes I do that better than others. Sometimes I finish an introduction and everybody's going...

JR: "That's it?"

MK: "Huh?" "And we come in where?"...(laughs)

JR: (laughs)

MK: Just do like the simplest thing possible. And then maybe you can change it. So it's clear.

JR: Yeah

MK: So if you just start with something really simple and then... (Plays an intro on G pedal with Cmaj to Do 2x then plays Eb-7 Ab7 phrase to D-7 G7b9 Cmaj6/9)

JR: So you went from one key and went to another...

MK: Well if we're in C then maybe I'll go into Ab (plays Ab13 sus) for a second.

JR: Ok. (MK continues to play). That's interesting. So it's like the relative minorish or major or something...

MK: I'm not thinking of anything like that. I'm thinking in terms of color If we're starting with this G pedal we could go (starts playing a different pattern that goes down via the b5 root: C/G to F#-7b5, F-), And the next chord would be C/E.

JR: Right

MK: But you could also. (Repeats the same chord phrase intro starting on C/G, F#-7b5, F-) But then you go minor instead (plays C-/Eb rather than C/E)

JR: So you went C minor mode there?

MK: Yeah. Just for a moment. That's how I think about intros. They don't have to be fancy. They don't have to have the kitchen sink. They just have to be clear and then maybe just one small idea that's a surprise.

Click below for an audio sample of above segment of the interview:
Mike Kanan playing C major ballad intro

JR: Right

MK: Just a little modicum of creativity. That's all. For me, I'm 45 now and really now just coming to terms with what I can leave out of my playing.

JR: Right..

MK: And how important that is. And that's maybe as important as anything I do play. Especially with singers. One of my favorite drummers is Jeff Williams? Don't know if you're familiar...

JR: Yeah. I know who he is.

MK: He lives now mostly in London, but... Great drummer. Great comper with his left hand. And he's a drummer that can play tons of shit all over the drumset. And loud. But for me, he never feels like he's in the way. It always feels completely transparent and completely wide open and he can shift gears at a moment's notice. Like if I color a voicing a certain way, I hear it coming out of the drums.

JR:Uh-huh. Like a cymbal shimmer or texture he chooses...

MK: Whatever. It might be a rhythm. He's listening so intently to everything I'm doing.

JR: Right

MK: So I asked him once. "How do you do that? How the hell do you comp like that?" And when I finally got him talking he said something that really stuck with me that I applied to piano. He said, "One thing that really took me some time to learn was if I'm comping and I play an idea, I don't need to play the whole idea. I can just play part of an idea. I don't have to finish it."

JR: Hmm

MK: You know? Think about that for comping. Like if you have some idea, for example if the singer or the horn player just did that then I'm going to do this.

JR: You get too involved in your own thing.

MK: You get too involved in your own idea and you're already behind where there are currently.

JR: Right

MK: So I found if I was going to play some fill like... (plays overly long phrase)Ofcourse that's a pretty long fill. But then I realized I could play like (plays shorter phrase). Just the first part of an idea and then leave it. And usually it sounds complete anyway. (click sample below for audio snippet of this part of conversation)
Mike comping phrases compared

JR: Some players have problems submerging their personality for the greater good. Even really good ones. And they get so developed. Although sometimes there's a place for that. For example a simultaneous dialogue. For example that record Affinity where Bill Evans is doing a lot of comping but it has so much personality that it's ok because it's kind of like a counterstatement. That can be ok if you're at that level. But if you're not, you can be too much into your own thing.

MK: Right. There's a real easy way to understand that whole issue. Sing with another piano player.And particularly with somebody who's not a skilled accompanist. You'll find out everything you need to know about how hip you're going to be.

JR: That's interesting

MK: I remember trying that out with a friend of mine years ago. And both of us were trying to do all kinds of hip stuff.

JR: And you were saying,"You're getting in my way..."

MK: He sang a tune and I was doing all kinds of goofy shit. And then I sang a tune and he did all kinds of goofy shit. Not intentionally. It's just that's what we were into at that time.

JR: Uh-Huh

MK: And then we finished and look at each other and say "You know all that goofy shit (you did)?" And he finishes and goes "Yeah that's really not good." (Laughs)

JR: Right

MK: But how would you know that unless you (tried that out)... And that's another thing for accompanying. You have to learn to sing a little bit. Not to be a singer. But I'll do it in sessions alot. I'll you know... If we're playing. I'll just sing a tune. Not to be a singer. I'm a horrible singer, but.

JR: I can never remember all the lyrics.

MK: That's another thing. You have to learn the lyrics. Now you can say well I'm submerging my personality. But all of us should be doing that. Including the singer...to the song

JR: Yeah

MK: In truth when everyone is doing that. And that happens in the best way, that's when everyone's personality comes out. Or perhaps something deeper than the individual personalites.

JR: Well, when Red was playing(saxophonist Red Horndstrom whom I referred to in previous posts)I kind of go back and forth about what style I'm going to use. Like the first night I stumbled upon a kind of propulsive, thematic style that I felt gave him the right kind of bounce underneath him that I tried to do the second time I played with him and couldn't do it but then Ed (Fuqua)was insisting that what I was doing this time was better... that I was listening and stuff. And I went well, I'm just not hearing that. I was trying to do what I was doing the first time. And then when you heard me I was totally underplaying.

MK: So that was the third time you played with him.

JR: That was the third time. I knew him before that. I met him previously on some of my gigs.

MK: My take is on it was in the first set--and I really wanted to stay for the second set--because already on the first tune (of the second set)... Just after talking and getting all that warm feeling from everybody, my interpretation was that he just unwound, let his shoulders down and said ok everything's fine and then I thought he sounded fantastic. The first tune of the second set--and then I had to go-- but that one sounded better than the whole first set. So I only imagine from there it continued to get better.

JR: Right

MK: But I thought your comping was just a model of good taste. I thought it sounded great. It didn't sound submerged. It sounded fully present and...

JR: Hmm.. See as a pianist I just have no perspective on that
(Especially given what I mentioned previously regarding my reaction to his presence in the audience)


Next time: Mike's Metronome Exercise

Hangin' with Mike Kanan, partI

Mike Kanan is a great accompanist. But he's pretty humble about his achievements in this regard. I personally find accompanying a vocalist extremely challenging and was definitely primed to get some first-rate advice from a pianist gigging with some of the major vocalists out there. But surprisingly his whole approach is very down to earth and his philosophy about it is very practical and has been arrived at by working things out over time, as well as through discussions and experiments with fellow musicians (to be referred to in follow-up parts).

As some of his comments might suggest, one of his most important assets may be his grounded personality. Even the practicing he does, by his own account, is not very advanced, but rather very specific and grounding in its purpose. So all in all he's a very grounded person personally and this pervades in his musical approach and the impression he gives to others which works well for him and those who hire him.

Which creates a sort of hilarious contrast to me. Because I'm sort of the roller coaster semi-nervous personality type. Case in point. When I arrived at his studio I realized I had dropped my cellphone back in Queens. This prevented me from being able to call him to open the door. When I got on the F train I had my headphones on and I was fiddling with stuff per usual and I thought I heard something drop. I looked at the platform and saw nothing so I thought it was my imagination and let the doors shut. It wasn't my imagination. Funny thing was later I went back to the platform and it turned out it had fallen in the gap between the train and the platform and it was lying on the tracks. I jumped down to get it with people staring at me, thinking I had lost my mind. In a fit of masochism I thought about "What if a train came bearing down on me, would my arms go all jelly on me as I tried to hoist myself up?" For a second I felt that weakness then ended my nut-job fantasy and hoisted myself up, half-giggling to myself. The phone was fine. Pretty sturdy little thing. Lousy phone but it can take a pounding apparently.

Below is the first part of what should be several installments of my get-together with Mike


JR: How did you manage to become the preferred singer's accompanist these days?

MK: Well I don't know about that...

JR: Did you just kind of fall into it?

MK: More or less. I've gotten some gigs that way and it's wound up...whatever... It's something about my personality that seems to function well in that...(type of setting)

JR: Well it has to be more than that. Singers can be real divas. If they don't like you, they'll tell you in no uncertain terms.

MK: Some. Although I have to say just about everyone I've worked with has been really good. The two principal well known ones -Jane (Monheit) and Jimmy Scott have been great to me personally and --just in terms of working with them-- it's very easy.

JR: How do you approach rubato accompaniment? Don't you find that a little bit challenging?

MK: I do. That's the hardest. You went right to the hardest thing.

JR: To figure out exactly where to be and...

MK: Yeah. It's hard. For me, rubato playing is playing in time.

JR: Yeah

MK: And that's the thing I think most people miss. If I'm doing a song with a singer and she says, "OK let's do this rubato" and I don't know the song, the first thing I say is "let's do this in tempo first" then do it rubato

JR: That's interesting.

MK: Because how am I going to get a sense of the phrasing?

JR: Well... sometimes they'll phrase it differently rubato.. where they "back-phrase" etc.

MK: That's the whole point. There has to be a starting point.

JR: Do you feel that's develops over the course of your relationship with a singer or..

MK: Of course it does...

JR: Or does it kind of like (snaps fingers)

MK: If you're lucky that kind of falls into place. If you happen to have this magical connection to a vocalist, sometimes that just happens. That's happened very seldom with me. And I'm still learning how to play rubato. I still think that I'm so-so.

JR: Really

MK: But, somebody like...

JR: Well you've done duets with her so you must've done a fair amount of that kind of thing- intros and

MK: Yeah. But Jane and I have been working this October will be 8 years. So we've had chance a lot of time to work a lot of things out.

JR: right

MK: And Jane is the kind of singer who pretty much does the same thing each time

JR: She gets her thing down

MK: She gets her thing down, whatever her interpretation is and she'll stick with it. For the most part. She'll change little things here and there. She--just as a specific case-- she's very clear about what she wants and with her it's very much-- she's in front. She's directing things.

JR: Who calls tempos? Does she?

MK: Ah.. Usually... well. You mean in a band setting?

JR: Yeah. You get up on stage and (snaps fingers). Because that's another thing that's difficult too. Calling the right tempo. To have a good tempo memory

MK: Definitely. I suck at that

JR: Really.

MK: That's one of my least favorite things.

JR: I used to work with this vocalist named Barbara King and always remember I used to feel that --in retrospect--"Oh, I my God I counted that off way too fast". Or "I counted that off way too slow".

MK: My feeling about tempo...I think that singers should count off the tempos. Most of the time they don't want to. I think there's two reasons for that. A lot of them are just insecure about their band leading skills, which is unfortunate. And like in Jane's case, she doesn't want to be the one counting the tempos. She wants it to-- her background is musical theatre-- so she wants everything to be like a show and the tunes should just start.

JR: Well she has two sides though. She has that and her jazzy side. She has the ability to go either way.

MK: Yeah. But well anyway we're getting into so many different topics all at once.

(This was sort of bad interviewing on my part. The point I was trying to make but being completely unclear about is that I understood Jane also had a reputation of being well schooled jazz musician and not a typical diva so counting off stuff shouldn't be an issue for her. But the main miss I made here is if Mike doesn't like counting tempos and Jane wants the tunes to just start, how do they start? and by whom? Guess we'll need to follow up with that at a later time)

MK: (continued)The tempo thing. My feeling about that is I hate being married to one tempo for a tune. I always feel like, we're in a different place every time. What came before the tune. What's going to come after it. How is the audience responding? Maybe they need to be goosed.

JR: Right

MK: I mean there's so many different things that affect tempo. But ultimately the singer is the one who has to phrase and has to tell the story. So the singer really should be the one determining the tempo. Maybe that's going to happen ahead of time.


JR: So if you were to, let say on- do you do Alfie? (he did a duet with Jane on her last album)

MK: We haven't done it in some time

JR: if she were to ask you to introduce it what would you do?

MK: Well that one was rubato. Do I even remember? How did we start this. (Sits back at the piano)

JR: What key?

MK: "A" major.

JR: A major? Wow

MK: I think what I was doing with that was I was starting in some another key and she would talk over my introduction (Starts playing light high chords descending in inversions in Ab major) So I'd be doing whatever and then at some point I would just (plays a low and resonant E7#9 chord)

JR: transition?

MK: And then I would try to lead the E natural in (the melody cue note) and she would sing the first phrase (sings, "What's it all about, Alfie?") And then I was just play that first sus chord and then we were off.

JR: OK.

MK: Where did you hear that?

JR: No. I've never heard it

MK: So how did you know about it if it wasn't on the Cd?

JR: What happened was I was surfing, looking for the album on Amazon and... What was it called? Surrender? And I decided to look at the liner notes for the album on Amazon and they referred to the cut of Alfie which..I was going, "that's not on the album".

MK: Oh that's right they didn't put that on the album. There's a whole story about that record

(Explanatory note. At that point Mike thought perhaps I was present for one of Jane's live performances of Alfie--and so his demonstration of how he handled the tune live with chords, patter,signal chords etc was what he showed me. What I was hoping was he would should me how he voiced and handled the studio version, which I have yet to hear because it is not available on most -I believe- online purchase versions)

More next time!

Hangin' with Mike

It wasn't my intention to interview Mike Kanan per se as pick his brains about piano. But given his greater stature in the music biz the questions just flowed on my part and with my my new toy the Zoom digital recorder in tow, I was able to capture the whole event.

I had first seen and heard Mike several years ago on a TV broadcast of vocalist, Jimmy Scott, where he performed his accompanist role and feature solos letter perfect. I was very impressed with his professionalism. He has since made several records with star jazz vocalist Jane Monheit. His work on her last album, Surrender is spot on and it includes some more pop and Brazilian influenced material. The first time I heard him in person was probably at least 2 years ago, where he was peforming with bassist Joe Martin and drummer Dwayne "Cook" Broadnax (an old cohort) at the midtown jazz piano haunt, Sofia's. I had just started becoming part of the rotation of jazz pianists that play there. It's quite intimidating to be part of a list of pianists that read like who's who of jazz piano.

As is typical of Sofia's, there were several people sitting in: a European fella who performed admirably on Hancock's Dolphin Dance and a tenor saxophonist who joined the band when Mike took the reins again. What I was impressed with was Mike's definitiveness and rhythmic certitude, nailing the pocket both in his comping and solos. This can be a deceptively difficult task at Sofia's where a. sometimes it's difficult to hear and get a blend and b. it's hard to swing on the Sofia's piano which has wear and tear from constant use, light action and a certain amount of unevenness that can throw you off. For whatever reason (fear, intimidation, shyness etc) I didn't introduce myself but waved to Cook.

I first came into contact with Mike through the omnipresent social networking site, MySpace. He had sent a friend request (which normally gets pretty freaking tiresome) and I responded with a "hey man, thanks for request" type reply. He then responded and commented about our mutual acquaintances, Ed Fuqua, Eric Halvorson and Eliot Zigmund and also some kind commentary on the few cuts on my page. He had also mentioned he hoped to catch me play but given I'm only a part-timer I told him the likelihood was that I would catch him first. The reality was his showing up at one of my gigs would be cause for a certain amount of anxiety. It was a lot easier just to let him listen to my tidy little recordings.

Later on the game was brought to me. I was asked to perform with saxophonist Red Horndstrom for small a concert&lecture at bassist/teacher Joe Solomon's studio at 26th st. Red, Ed and I had performed at Sofia's and Joe cooked up the idea of Red giving a lecture/performance to his students after seeing us play. Drummer, Chris Roselli was added for the gig. Performing in front of students is one thing but in the middle of a tune, Mike walks in the door and it completely threw me. Joe and Mike know each other thru the Tristano/Mosca circle. We were in the middle of starting the tune I Fall in Love to Easily but it's one of those tunes that it's easy to Fall Into the wrong minor II-V if you're not completely focused (I Should Care is like that too). And that's what happened. I weasled my way out of my misstep on A-7b5 but the game was lost. I was completely out of it. So there I had done it. I f##$d up in front of a fellow musician whom I respect. For me that's the cardinal sin, especially if you don't know them because as the commercials say, "you never get a second chance to make a first impression". I let off steam by acknowledging his presence to the audience and recover modestly on the next tune.

When I finish the set I introduce myself to him, make light of my performance and we shoot the breeze. He compliments me several times on my playing and frankly I'm shocked so I don't know whether he was being polite or whether he really thought I sounded good. But a day or two later he reiterates his compliment by communication via MySpace email. I was delighted. Maybe I'm better than I think. I then ask if we could talk shop about some piano stuff and he suggests we get together at his Brooklyn studio. I will have a transcription of some of the highlights of the get together next time.